Handguns

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steveb
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Handguns

Post by steveb » Fri Jan 07, 2005 10:19 am

I am new to the gun world besides being in the navy for 10 years and carrying the 9 mm and .45. I just received my concealed weapons permit and was wondering what is a good gun to start with that is relatively inexpensive

marcw

Post by marcw » Fri Jan 07, 2005 6:49 pm

Steve, This is one of those types of questions where if you asked 10 people you'd get 10 different responses! Basically, you will have to take in as much information as possible, determine if that info falls in line with your skill level, size, experience, budget, mindset, ideals, etc.

Personally, I'm a little guy so CCing a 5" 1911 is gonna be very difficult for me. I can probably get away with it in the winter but I don't subscribe to having different carry pistols for different seasons. I believe in finding something that works for you and sticking with it. Train, practice, train some more, practice and take some professional training...that is what will make you proficient if, God forbid, you ever need to use your CCW. That is why I stuck with Glocks (based on Scott's advice) and I have 6000+ rounds through my G17 and G19 since last December. By shooting them so much I have taugh myself a new set of motorskills and that is what will count if I even need to take that last step.

The key is using what you have or in this case what you are going to buy so a few questions are in order.

How tall are you?
How much do you weight?
What type of clothing do you normally wear?
How often do you plan on carrying?
How much of a budget do you have?

Keep in mind that with budget you need to factor in a belt and holster, maybe a spare mag holder and some defensive ammo.

Scott was a huge help when I picked out my CCW and I've relied on him dozens of times since then. It also helps, once you narrow down your choices to be able to shoot some of the models so find a buddy that has one or a rental that you can fire just to be sure.

This is the start of a long process but we'll help you out :wink:

Marie
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Carry Pistol

Post by Marie » Mon Jan 10, 2005 10:19 pm

I would also say go with the Glock. It's an affordable handgun that can be used at the range and for carry. There are three different models in most of the calibers, depending on your preferences and hand size. For the folks who just don't like the "plastic" guns you might try a Kahr pistol. They are a nice size pistol in steel frame both in 9mm and 40. There's an economy model, the E9 which has a very nice feel to it. Best bet is to try some out at the range, like Marc suggested. There are so many different models to choose from! Good luck. Marie

jacobebel
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Post by jacobebel » Wed Jan 12, 2005 9:59 pm

I agree with what the others are saying. If your Navy experience was anything like my Army one, you didn't spend much time shooting the handguns you carried, and they were probably empty most of the time anyway while on duty. The Glock 19 is a great pistol for concealed carry, in that it is light, very accurate, and has the same trigger pull all the time. I would shy away from a double action pistol just because of the different trigger pull. Legally, a Glock is considered double action, so it is defensible in court. At least that's what Massad Ayoob states in the latest issue of Combat Handguns. One thing to change for sure on the Glock, however, are the terrible sights it comes with. Put a set of 3 dot night sights on there, and you are ready. Other than that, the Glock is ready right out of the box. I personally carry a .45, because I like the single action, and I consider it safe because of the double safety system. It is also thinner than a Glock, and therefore easier to conceal. In terms of bullet velocity, the .45 is better than a 9mm, in my opinion, because there is less chance of it travelling further than what you intend, if you need to shoot a human being. From the ballistics tests and real world experiences I have read, the 9mm will go through the target and keep on going, possibly injuring innocent bystanders. A .45 has a better chance of staying in the body. Of course, hopefully that will never ever happen. Once you get a handgun, shoot it at least once a week. Practice drawing it from concealed every chance you get. You want to have a bond with your weapon. I personally practice for about 10 minutes every night, from concealed, and it pays off. I got timed once, and was able to draw my Glock I was carrying, the Model 19, from under two garments and hit a small plastic bottle at about 20 feet in just .88 seconds. Thats what constant practice will do for you, it builds confidence and skill. Anyway, hope this helps you out in a least some small way.

servemebeer
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Post by servemebeer » Sat Feb 12, 2005 12:54 pm

I say go for it too. My first pistol was the glock 19 which I purchased from
topglock and had it transferred by the folks at the armory a while back. I knew from talking to others that you couldnt go wrong with a glock for a first timer, so I went to the range and shot a 9mm, .40, and a .45. I decided to go with the 9 because the ammo is cheaper and i figured I can always upgrade to a bigger cal once I became proficient. Also I wanted my fiance to be able to learn on something that didnt quite have the kick as the bigger calibers. Go shoot a few and see for yourself which one you are comfortable with and go for it, as they said; cant go wrong with glock dude.

Diznuff
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Post by Diznuff » Fri Aug 05, 2005 10:30 pm

Ruger makes a good line of hand guns at a affordable price. They have a new smaller model for CCW the P345. Also Para Ordinance has a pistol ironically named....the CCW. Kahr Arms also makes a few concealable friendly pistols. Just giving some other options besides glock ;)

Splitter
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Post by Splitter » Sat Aug 27, 2005 6:18 pm

I carry a Bersa Thunder .380. It is about the size and style of a Walther PPK. Nice size, not too big not too small. Nice round, I think. Works for me. And it didn't cost me an arm and a leg.. $230.00 Not bad.
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SigSauer P230 .380ACP
Glock G27 .40SW
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Villimus Rex

Post by Villimus Rex » Sun Aug 28, 2005 8:11 am

Keep in mind, the .25 that is now in your pcket is a far more effective means of self defence than the .44 mag that is sitting in your closet because it is too heavy to carry.
I carry a DDR Makarov or Polski Pistolet 64 both in 9x18mm depending upon how I am dressed.

Redrum

Post by Redrum » Mon Sep 26, 2005 4:30 pm

Buying a handgun is like buying a vehicle....What is your purpose for buying it? Vehicles can be purchased for just transportation, or hauling items or hauling people or all of the above. Firearms are the same way. You have to kinda get an idea of what you want to do with it. Selfdefense/carry? maybe competition? Maybe Plinking? If you are thinking of competition then which? IDPA...USPSA...3-gun ....Then you need to check with those programs as to the minimum caliber allowed. (9mm for both IDPA and USPSA. .380ACP will not be allowed except for BUG matches).

So saying ...what is good...You will get 2 or maybe 3 answers from every person that you ask. With some specifics people can give you much better advice as to what range of firearms would fill your needs.

and last and certainly not least....what is your budget????

Mike Wood
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Post by Mike Wood » Wed Sep 28, 2005 1:27 am

Steve,
I would carry as much gun as you feel comfortable with in a good holster that does not flop around and supports the weight of the firearm WELL. That means the holster should have "outrigger" type loops that prevent side to side movement of the gun. It will make a difference in how heavy a gun you will/can tote.

Although bullet placement is paramount, don't get anything that has a caliber less than.40 unless it's a really hot cartridge like .357 for instance. If you ever actually do some tests shooting objects with different calibers it's a real eye opener- moreso than just reading about it. Pistol ammo cannot come close to competing with any long gun, (short barrel/fast powder=low velocity-compared to rifle) so making bigger holes helps offset the handicap... somewhat.

I have a bone to pick with you Glock guys, you always recommend your favorite model Glock and tout it's reliability etc. but you never mention the KABOOM FACTOR! Yes Glocks can and will blow up. The reason is: the gun will fire OUT OF BATTERY. Please mention this when you recommend a Glock to someone. I've seen the photos (several) and it was even mentioned in the IDPA magazine awhile back in an article of recommended guns and more than one longtime RO has witnessed these blow ups. I've never heard of anyone getting hurt but it certainly bears mentioning.

Having said all that, I would recommend a Glock (surprisesurprise) or XD if you're new, as they are probably the most out the box reliable and simple guns to operate/shoot. They do malfunction "sometimes" though, I've seen it in the IDPA matches we hold at NCRR, probably due to ammo. If you stick to factory jacketed ammo like Glock recommends you'll probably never have that problem, but the issue with an "out of battery kaboom" is you WILL NOT know the gun is out of battery (a little bit) even if your just shooting Bullseye until you pull the trigger. I've had it happen on my 1911's over the years several times on new/tight or dirty guns when I used to use Unique powder and did not case check my ammo but the gun did NOT fire because it WILL NOT fire out of battery. 1911's are really not for new shooters though, and generally require some "massaging" to be 100% reliable.

I did not like Glocks or any plastic gun when they 1st came out, but the gun has proven itself to be VERY reliable and with a low bore axis the gun shoots very well in competition. Being a reloader and not cleaning my guns until they start to malfunction- on my DW, over 1000rds now and counting (laziness) I can't bring myself to buy one; but if they fix what I think is a VERY serious design flaw I would consider it. Don't buy price- wait until you can get what you want. Don't hesitate to get a used gun, I actually prefer a used gun as it has been "tested", guns are simple enough devices so you don't have to have too much concern over "what was done to it"- unless someone really buggered it up you can correct most faults fairly cheap.

My 1 1/2 cents
Mike
Of all the things that I lost in getting older, it's my mind that I miss the most.

Wayne The Shrink
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Post by Wayne The Shrink » Thu Sep 29, 2005 7:37 am

Steve

Go to Bob's in Norfolk upstairs range, or the one on VB Blvd. in Pembroke (upstairs range). For about $5 you can shoot any of the guns they have for rent. Shoot anything that looks interesting, take notes. Go home, sit and think about it, considering the comments above.

Then go into the Armory and talk to one of the guys. You'll get good carry advice, they'll show you carry options, and sell you what you have found to be comfortable.

To be honest, the guys at Bob's will do all that, too. I've just found Bill and Marie's place to be the more friendly, approachable, and just all around nice.
There is no 'right' that requires me to work for you or you to work for me.

Redrum

Post by Redrum » Thu Sep 29, 2005 7:54 am

Wayne...let me chime in with usually less expensive as well!!!!

Wayne The Shrink
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Post by Wayne The Shrink » Thu Sep 29, 2005 7:56 am

Yeah, and what I really like is that if they don't have what you want and Bob does, they'll send you to Bob's! It's a nice community of shops around here.
There is no 'right' that requires me to work for you or you to work for me.

map454

Confused

Post by map454 » Sat Nov 05, 2005 3:44 pm

Ruger makes a good line of hand guns at a affordable price. They have a new smaller model for CCW the P345. Also Para Ordinance has a pistol ironically named....the CCW. Kahr Arms also makes a few concealable friendly pistols. Just giving some other options besides glock ;)
I just do not get it....

Splitter
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Re: Confused

Post by Splitter » Sat Nov 05, 2005 6:05 pm

map454 wrote:
Ruger makes a good line of hand guns at a affordable price. They have a new smaller model for CCW the P345. Also Para Ordinance has a pistol ironically named....the CCW. Kahr Arms also makes a few concealable friendly pistols. Just giving some other options besides glock ;)
I just do not get it....
Hmm.. what part of this explanation don't you get?
Support Israel!

SigSauer P239 .40SW
SigSauer P230 .380ACP
Glock G27 .40SW
SW Model 10-6 .38SPL

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